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Feb. 11th, 2005 @ 11:05 am dutch boyd
A number of people have sent me dutch boyd's blog entry about me and it looks like a good excuse to author a reciprocal entry.

In reality I'm not quite as down on dutch as some might think. I don't think he is irredeemable.

I consider him personally responsible for pokerspot's debts because by his own admission, he lied to customers about the status of their cashouts while trying to sort out his financial problems. Even if he hadn't done that, it's simply not right to use customer deposits as working capital in a gambling business. People with money on deposit are not investors. They may implicitly be risking that money, but they aren't reaping any of the rewards of investment and they should not be subject to the risks. It should never have happened.

But it happened anyway, OK. Then, as I read the accounts including his, he had opportunities to sell the pokerspot assets for a sum of money sufficient to pay off the depositors, but he passed on those opportunities because he didn't think the deal was good enough. And when all was said and done time had passed them by and the assets had no value. Now he had proceeded into gambling with other peoples' money -- betting on getting a better deal for himself -- and the wheel came up zero.

Then with that history under his belt, he tried (and perhaps is still trying) to start another new poker-related business. By itself that doesn't necessarily pull his standing any lower but it's such a huge error in judgment that it doesn't bode well for the quality of his other decisions.

Then there was an old livejournal entry (user havoj) of his that it appears he has since deleted. I commented on it on rgp but unfortunately didn't repost it, so I can't find the precise text that led me to say "frightening misogynistic objectification of half the human species". Suffice to say that it betrayed a very scary attitude about women.

All of that adds up to plenty of reason to dislike the guy without ever having met him. I have met him though, and he's probably right that we'd get along, at least superficially, if I were willing to associate with him. He has some positive qualities and we do have some similarities. However, to me the most essential quality in a human being is honesty. To me dishonesty is intolerable, unlivable, and when someone else doesn't feel the same way it makes them into undesirable company.

If dutch provided restitution for pokerspot I'd be willing to give him something of a fresh start, but as I told him, making up for pokerspot doesn't mean continuing to live as he lives and hoping to hit a big score someday. It means making visible, personal sacrifices while devoting every dollar he can spare to paying everyone back, with interest. Nothing can be done to alter some of the unfortunate tales from back when it happened, such as the guy who claimed to have lost his girlfriend and house over it, but he can worry about additional penance after he takes the unavoidable first step: paying the debt.

I know it's a lot of money but the point isn't whether he can pay it all off, the point is whether he is genuinely trying. Talking about wanting to do it is not trying. Sending some money every month, enough money that he misses it: that is trying.

Also, I suspect his image as conveyed by television is much lamer than he himself is, but perhaps I have an unusually large amount of sympathy for that one.
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From:im_jayistheman
Date:February 11th, 2005 07:32 pm (UTC)

Paulp is quite the hot subject among internet posters

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in the spirit of Dutch's posting about you, i figured you might be interested in this...

http://www.fullcontactpoker.com/poker-forum/viewtopic.php?t=3947

somehow a post about TJ's gambling habits becomes a debate about mr. phillips.

On a side note to this side note:
If the user under the name 'extempore' on the fullcontact forum is, indeed, you, i would thouroughly enjoy watching you run circles around some of the idiots on there.
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From:qwrrty
Date:February 11th, 2005 07:46 pm (UTC)

Re: Paulp is quite the hot subject among internet posters

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As for Paul Phillips and his blog, I can't stand the guy. First of all, I always have to have a dictionary near by when I read his blog. The guy speaks like he's the smartest person in the world.

it is too much! i die!!
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From:nathashish
Date:February 11th, 2005 08:20 pm (UTC)

Re: Paulp is quite the hot subject among internet posters

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"First of all, I always have to have a dictionary near by when I read his blog. The guy speaks like he's the smartest person in the world."

Yeah, all that fancy book-learnin' done taught Paul some polysyllabic words. I love the "I'm insecure about my own intellect, so I hate it when other people express theirs" line of argument.
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From:extempore
Date:February 11th, 2005 07:51 pm (UTC)

Re: Paulp is quite the hot subject among internet posters

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The best one is this: Paul Phillips makes me sick. His blog reads like stereo instructions. How somebody that successful can be that miserable is beyond me.

Either that guy left out a transition sentence or he has an unhealthy contempt for home electronics installation.
From:mookie99
Date:February 11th, 2005 08:03 pm (UTC)

Re: Paulp is quite the hot subject among internet posters

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This is exactly why I enjoy reading your blog, although I shouldn't while I eat my lunch.....I was in the middle of my PB&J sandwich and laughed half of it all over my laptop screen.
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From:joepro
Date:February 11th, 2005 09:42 pm (UTC)

PAULP fiction

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This sh-- is hilarious! That stereo line reminds me of the time Chevy Chase called Howard Stern an "egg timer." Howard had a field day with that one.

As far as Dutch Boyd goes, I think Paulp is right on. Don't talk like you're sorry about people losing money on your site and then not pay them. And especially, don't start a new poker website and expect people to pay you! One last thing, was that ebay thing with Dutch for real or a farce? You could buy a piece of Dutch at the WSOP Satellites.
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From:walterzuey
Date:February 11th, 2005 08:27 pm (UTC)

from rgp

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So this guy named Gaines has me down to talk some business. I fly into Baton Rouge after a 12 hour stint of layovers in Dallas and Vegas. Sick. Tekhead meets me at the airport and we drive over to Gaines' place. It's all the way in the middle of nowhere, and we go in through this huge gate. This place is HUGE, and only one guy lives there. He bought another place for his wife and stepdaughter. And I don't think he even ever married his wife... anyway, this stepdaughter of his sent up some picture to Culver City because she wanted to meet me after I was on ESPN for the wsorld series of poker. And this girl is pretty hot in her pictures... strawberry blonde hair and gorgeous tits bought and paid for. Not really my type. I want a girl with fake breasts who is sorry that at one point in her life she was superficial (like my last gf Charli). "


It got worse as I recall something like do-her-and-throw-her-away. Google didn't cache anything with "wsorld series of poker" unfortunately.
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From:jeffhawkins
Date:February 11th, 2005 08:08 pm (UTC)
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I didn't follow it closely enough, mostly due to indifference, but was there ever a criminal investigation into the financial dealings of Dutch and his site?
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From:evildmguy
Date:February 11th, 2005 09:36 pm (UTC)
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Do you know if there a place where I can get the story? I didn't realize Dutch was involved with this but then I don't follow him.

Thanks!

Have a good one! Take care!

edg
From:danielhoerr
Date:February 14th, 2005 08:24 pm (UTC)
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From:evildmguy
Date:February 11th, 2005 09:30 pm (UTC)
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I just want to say that I enjoy your live journal, and whatever you want to talk about. (I especially loved that you are an apatheist! That was a cool link!) Yes, I came over here because I found the poker fad. However, I read your LJ and came to find that there is a LOT more to you than poker. You have some great qualities, such as the whole honesty thing, that I really admire. As such, I like reading about you on your blog.

Thanks for sharing!

Have a good one! Take care!

edg
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From:phatjoe
Date:February 11th, 2005 09:52 pm (UTC)
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I'm gonna have to back this guy up. I enjoy reading your (Paul's) entries because you are generally well-spoken and think before posting. It also helps that I share interest in most of the subjects you tend to discuss.

/joe
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From:metsfan
Date:February 11th, 2005 10:34 pm (UTC)

Unfortunately...

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The Internet Archive only has the post after it was already deleted.

That's a shame. http://web.archive.org/web/20031123062600/http://www.livejournal.com/users/havoj/
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From:thefakeg
Date:February 12th, 2005 03:34 pm (UTC)

Re: Unfortunately...

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There are a few wonderful replies in the two or three most recent posts there from some dude named "anonymous", as well as this little boast from Dutch himself:

I've been on the mischief trail of some pretty bad guys today. About a year and a half ago, two companies ripped my little dot com off for about $600k. Now I'm going to go find the bastards and take them to court. I'll figure out where they hid the assets, and if they won't show me, I'll have them thrown in prison for fraud. Or maybe I'll just skip the middle man and go down there with a cigar cutter. This little piggy... we'll see how it goes.

HA!
From:drizztdj
Date:February 14th, 2005 02:40 pm (UTC)
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Why can't people just enjoy good banter and not get into a flame war on the net?

Is it the same concept as someone who is suddenly given power over another is more likely to abuse that power?

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From:ghd_mk4
Date:June 26th, 2010 02:32 am (UTC)
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I love it!