day two mirage

Maybe he wanted a story to tell his friends back home.

It seems to me there are only two ways he makes this play:
1) He's in his first tournament ever and really wants to put a move on a big-name player, so he can have something to tell his friends when they ask how the tourney was.
2) He's a decent, online player. He probably realizes the table has him pegged as tight, so he called your raise hoping for a scary flop (like you said). He then made a play you see a lot online; he bet a suspiciously small amount into a scary board before the aggressor has a chance to act.

I vote for option 1.

Re: Maybe he wanted a story to tell his friends back home.

I vote for - not enough information to judge the player. Mostly information on how the player would be perceiving Paul. There should be a reason why he thought Paul might make a move (awareness/paranoia of his tight image, or Paul made moves on other players earlier). Or he is lying and he saw Paul's ability to make big laydowns and took advantage????

I'd vote for option 2, but with a twist. By being a very tight player, he comes up with the opportunity to make easier bluffs on rare occasion against guys like Paul and other bigger poker pros because unless paul hit trips or 2 pair on that flop, he is going to be pretty worried about a skeptical bet like that in the first place. Even with aces, Paul would find himself worried, and rightfully so, because like he said, he had the guy pegged for a range of hands and if anything in that range was on the board and paul didn't hit a set. I still agree that the guy was an idiot for playing it that way and will continue to have that mindset, because of the post hand comment. Everyone who has seen paul play, even if it is only on the WPT on TV knows that he doesn't exactly 'make moves on people' especially for 1/4 of his stack. no good player wants to risk that much for what usually comes up as such little gain in the end when compared to their chip stack. anyone agree?

Haha, reminds me of home games....makes perfect sense trying to bluff the guy who plays one hand an hour; there's nothing you can do about these guys, it just sucks when they never get reads or put you on a hand.

How many people make a mistake by holding on to AA with a flop like that?

I don't know why you're kicking yourself--there's no way calling him down with AA there could possibly be a winning play in the long run, is there? Am I missing something?

I think the AA laydown is fine-- it's the absolute worst board you can see with those aces, given that you've reraised him and he called.

Now if you know your player well enough to know he's decided you're making a play on him and he's making that goofy play no matter what the flop is (a la what fetadingo suggested), well, that's different. I don't see how you can know that at this point, though. For a decent player to call that reraise, putting him on JJ-KK isn't unreasonable at all (or even AK with the ace of spades which is still not good for you).

Paul Read this Peter's (56 Clubs) Response

I am the person who was involved in that hand with Paul.. My name is Peter. I am a fan of Pauls, had read his live journal before.

Had the opportunity to sit next to him for about 2 hours in my first live tournament (most of my experience is online). He was very approachable and a good guy to be sitting with, for that matter a good table for 2 hours, we also had Stan Schier, and Barry Shulman there who were all in our end of the table and fun to play poker with

Much better than my first table, who consisted of Johnny Chan, Daniel Negraneu, David Oppenhiem, David Grey, David Williams, and Jean Robert (Bobby).. that table was sick with aggression!! But what stories I have.

Having picked up NO cards at that table, I found myself in a situation to play on a very short stack the entire day one, I finally doubled up early on with AA in day 2 before being moved to Pauls Table. It really sucks to be sitting around in your first live 10K buy in tournament and have no chips. I found myself going all in a few times, with the best hand and getting lucky not to be outdrawn on.

Which puts me at Pauls table with about 45K in chips, 2nd or third hand a dream situation arises, BB with 4hKh, 5 limpers ..

flop comes 44J rainbow...

small blind checks, I of course check, and then UTG +6 makes it 5K, Shulman Re-raises to 10K (he must have been bored) and the small blind makes it 25K (stan)

I almost thought after I went all in that I might of misread my hand and didnt really have the 4.. In fact Stan says hes beat and calls the allin shows 34 and now triples me up to 100K. Man what a feeling, im one of the large stacks at MY FIRST LIVE 10K tourney, and I dont want to make a stupid mistake to jepordize my stack size and go back to where I was having to go allin on any real hand.

Which will exlain my laydown, of QQ to Stans all in.. keep in mind I am sandwiched between a Raise and Call and a Re-Raise all in. Im sorry where I come from this screams of strength, maybe from this experience I will take Pauls advise of calling the raise and if I get re raised by the original raiser toss the hand. However I knew by showing the QQ Paul would peg me as too tight of a player, something I could use on him or someone else at that table in the future.

A hand before the hand in the big blind I held JJ, one limper I shot it up to 3600 and the limper (who was even more in experienced than me) re-raised me to 9000 and I Fold.

Which puts me to the very next hand.. I have 56 clubs, under the gun Dan Harrington will tell you, when he makes a move he will make it with a suited connector in early pos.. he also has a very tight table image.

So I have the 56clubs shoot it up to 3600K and Paul immediately re raised to 10600. Mind you from the time I sat down with Paul nothing told me different that he was holding Aces or Kings. I called his raise for 3 reasons;

#1 I folded to a reraise the hand before ( I didnt want people at the table thinking they could move me off a hand with a reraise every time )

#2 I had 56clubs if anything you can hold against the Aces its a hand like this, rather than KK or QQ, etc. So I thought if I hit the flop hard I could win a monster, because Paul would never, ever with my table image put me on that hand.

#3 I could get a really scary flop, and win a big pot with a small bet

you all know the rest.. but now you have my side of the story

I showed the hand for 2 reasons, Paul showed me his aces, usually when someone does that he wants to see your hand and because we had a big gallery watching Paul and I thought it would be fun to crystalize my big poker moment of bluffing a champ like Paul. I later regretted the decision to show Paul the hand, because I really enjoyed playing poker with him, we shared some thoughts on a few hands and I beleive I got some valuable lessons from him. Also that hand really rattled him, if I could give him some advise he should of just let it go. He is too good of a player to be rattled by what I consider a bad beat. I dont think I outplayed him as much as the board and everything leading up to the situation did. ( I think you owe me a bad beat chip Paul )

Peter

Re: Paul Read this Peter's (56 Clubs) Response

I later regretted the decision to show Paul the hand

Don't regret it! When you get a result like that I say show it... it's more likely to work for you than against you. Maybe not with me, but in general.

Also that hand really rattled him, if I could give him some advise he should of just let it go.

It annoyed me and I didn't hide it but "rattle" connotes that it affected my play, which it didn't. I can be visibly dissatisfied with a hand and still bring the A game.

I think you owe me a bad beat chip Paul

If I ever get those "I bluffed paul phillips in a key pot" chips made up I'll save one for you.

Re: Paul Read this Peter's (56 Clubs) Response Contd

I should of said, i called you because i didnt want anyone making moves on me. rather than I thought you were putting a move on me...

Anyway I gave alot of my chips away on another hand going card dead and bored I played AJ in middle pos to a player holding AQ in the BB I played that hand like a donkey the flop Ah Kh 7s and the big blind bets 5 k into me, i put him on a heart draw and raise to 20K, he calls turn Kd that card freezes both of us, check check, river comes a brick and he bets 10k into me, thinking he missed his flush I call, when I should of pushed allin (representing AK ) (Dan Harrington would of shot me for playing AJ in that pos in the first place) , so I became a short stack and got knocked out in 44th place in day 3.

What a excellent experiece in playing in that tourney...

I already won a WSOP seat and am working on a Ultimate Bet Aruba seat, so I hope you get the chance to get me back.

Peter

Re: Paul Read this Peter's (56 Clubs) Response Contd

Anyway I gave alot of my chips away on another hand going card dead and bored I played AJ in middle pos to a player holding AQ in the BB

I was still around for that hand. You probably could have won it with a big river raise but the only hand you could beat by raising and not by calling was exactly the hand he had (AQ)... on the other hand that's exactly what it looked like he had. Tough situation.

Re: Paul Read this Peter's (56 Clubs) Response Contd

This is some highly entertaining reading material, thanks guys. BTW I have mad respect for anyone who plays in a 10k tournament, no matter how they got there. There may be a few knuckleheads playing at these, but to an average schmoe like myself, it's pretty impressive for someone just to play at that level. From this dude 56 club's post, it seems like he didn't embarrass himself, even up against the best in the world.

Re: Paul Read this Peter's (56 Clubs) Response

Thanks for sharing your side of the hand, 56 Clubs. It was great reading both players' thoughts. Congratulations on your good run in the tourney.

Once again I burn myself by crediting someone else with too extensive a thought process.

I find this to be one of the most amusing aspects of poker. Although, immediately after you've expended all that mental energy for no apparent reason, it's anything but amusing.

One of my favorite principles of no-limit holdem is this:

If you fold, you don't get to see how badly the other guy hosed.

On the last move-in hand : just out of curiosity, what range of hands would you normally expect to get called by when you make this move, at this stage of a 10K tournament ? I'm going to guess AA-TT/AK-AQ. Obviously the range is different according to the potential caller's position, but as a rough guide. I was a bit sceptical about this play until I worked it out, but with that range it's break even just to win the blinds and antes, and you're on a freeroll if you get called.

If someone's going to call you with KJ though, that kind of screws it :-(.

Andy.

paul .. your thoughts...

I know this journal is not a forum for you to shell out poker advise but...

the hand when stan raised 6000 middle pos.. preflop.. and I called behind him with aq.. bb also called flop comes q 8 4 rainbow bb checks and stan checks.. I bet my aq .. bb folds and stan raises allin. I ask him for a count down and he is shaking like I have never seen someone shake before... you smirk and after the hand you made a comment that he almost exposed his hole cards because he shook so much.

now that was the most screwed up count down and the most shaking I have ever seen.. do u make that call ( I folded ) knowing him better than me. ???? he later claims after my laydown to have kk.. I don't check raise kk in that situation ... I doubt you do either..